Tuesday, June 11, 2013

First up for pre-season rankings...NCS Division V

They will be posted by Friday evening.  I think I have a pretty good grasp of the division after getting lots of feedback from many of the competing coaches.  The unsure parts are the incoming freshmen and the motivated summer runners.  We will just have to see about those two aspects once the season begins so until then, ready or not, the first of the pre-rankings are almost here.

45 comments:

Anonymous said...

I'm gonna go out here on a limb and say SJND is going to win NCS d5

Anonymous said...

I don't know man, that's kind of a risky pick...

Anonymous said...

Why do you say that????????????????!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

^all the same person?

Anonymous said...

Just a failed attempt at humor. Clearly the SJND will win this coming year, as long as they don't have any injuries or roster issues.

Anonymous said...

NCS D5... lol

Anonymous said...

oh, so NCS is laughable? NCS beat the rest of the state in d5 (and a quite a few in higher divisions) last year - wait until the end of the season to lol

Anonymous said...

Pretty sure SJNDs placing in their race had them winning d4 too so lol indeed

Anonymous said...

The top D5 team is usually right near to or slightly faster than the top D4 team. D4 is a lot deeper than D5, though, so by the time you compare the 4th or 5th place teams or, say, the top 20 or 30 individuals, D4 gets the nod.

It makes sense since many D5 schools are private. Most CIF sports with state championships in D5 are won by non-public schools.

Anonymous said...

Let's not get in a division battle. Every division has it's advantages and disadvantages. The way I see it all what matter is how you do at the end of the year in your respectively divisions.

Anonymous said...

D5 in general is a joke. The state mandate should be 1000 and less. Rich private school division. There should be an open division for the top teams and then 3 more. The competition is already watered down as is and the best don't race the best.

CIF classifies XC as an individual event. Shouldn't even have divisions.

Anonymous said...

yeah wait.. divisions are stupid.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous @ 2:35

That's ridiculous for you to say. Dividing schools by size makes sense as it doesn't force a tiny 300-person school to compete against a 2500-person behemoth. While the system needs revision, clearly, divisions in general are not "stupid."

Anonymous said...

@2:07 PM
De La Salle is D1

Anonymous said...

DV is lame!

Anonymous said...

I bet you guys wouldnt even be able to win state as a individual so stop saying it sucks

EVERYBODY said...

i could

Anonymous said...

Me too!

Anonymous said...

DV has a few talented runners, but no depth. So what occurs, is a bunch of pathetic runners make it to State by virtue of being on a team. This is similar to what occurs for entry to MOC for track- guys who can't even break 10 min. for 2 miles going to MOC because their division is made up of a bunch of rich private school primadonnas.

Anonymous said...

THAT IS SO RACIST!!!!

Trollin' said...

CC is an individual sport like track, wrestling, swimming, golf... All no divisions. If you are rich and choose to go to a 300 person school that's on you. Divisions only water down the talent. Every team sport is moving to an open division so the best play the best. Divisions are like JV titles. So what is CC? An individual sport or team? No divisions or open. Take your pic. CC will be last though because its not dominated by privates. Outside of a few the privates suck. And they are only good in their weak D5.

Anonymous said...

at ncs d5 im gonna be like 'GAAAAAAAYYYYYB' as i root for gabe to beat t-hart

Anonymous said...

just to illustrate the differences in depth....

at 2012 state meet....
in d1, 15:59 was 50th
in d2, 16:00 was 29th
in d3, 16:00 was 24th
in d4, 15:58 was 11th
in d5, 15:59 was 6th

Anonymous said...

To Anonymous @ 6:59,
Track is all "D1"; everyone runs against everyone else. There are no track "divisions" in NCS. Whoever got to MOC got there because they ran their event and made the qualifying cuts - big schools and small - apples to apples.

Anonymous said...

let's go back to bashing camplindo; i've had it with the d5/sjnd bashing!

Anonymous said...

The reason DV lacks depth is because there are simply fewer kids in each school. The way to look at it is 1 out of every 400 kids is going to be good/great. Therefore, each DV school (~400 kids and less) will have 1 good/great runner. In a DI school with 4000 kids, you have 10 good/great kids.

There are MORE KIDS in lower divisions, so of course there will be MORE fast kids. It has nothing to do with the "private school primadonnas" nor wealth. Richness has nothing to do with how fast you are, so get over the whole "Rich Private School" bs.

Anonymous said...

Track has 14 divisions:
100m
200m
400m
800m
1600m
3200m
110h
300h
LJ
TJ
HJ
PV
SP
DT

Wrestling has 14 divisions (weight class)

Swimming doesn't have a state championship (?!) but would have divisions as Track does.

Stop complaining about XC's five divisions.

Anonymous said...

How many publics outside of charters are under 500. It is a rich private school division.

D5 is watered down with no depth, thus a waste.

In CC the best don't race the best.

Events are not like divisions. Otherwise there are 22 divisions in 5 divisions for football? Uh huh.

And since you wanted some Campolindo bashing... With the best coach in Nor Cal why can't the boys win a state title? Just shows how much harder it is to coach boys. If Campolindo is so great why can't they get it done?

Anonymous said...

Man, there are some hostile jerks in this thread.

Or one jerk who keeps posting over and over - not sure about that.

Cross country is NOT an individual sport. The top five runners score for the team. It is ridiculous to think that a school with 300 kids can compete against James Logan with 4000 kids, no matter how hard they trained.

My daughter's team had about 15 runners last year, 8 girls and 7 boys. They went to an invitational at Golden Gate Park where Bellermine had 75 FRESHMEN boys running in one race.

Should they just abandon cross-country?

Anonymous said...

Let's chillax with all the harsh and derogatory comments, dudes. Like whoa.

Anonymous said...

Im sorry if the truth here hurts youre feelings. Nothing deragotory, just truth. Doesn't matter how big your team is, you only need 5. And for the record, cross country is an INDIVIDUAL sport and is classified as such by the CIF. There is a team component like in track, swimming, golf, etc. but based off individual performances combined together. Jordan Hassey was D5, quit making excuses. Like I said, the best need to race the best. Top 3 teams and 5 individuals not on a team should automatically be bumped to open. Spitting up the talent is bad for the sport.

Anonymous said...

No one is making excuses, and the truth does not hurt "youre" feelings. Sure, Jordan Hassay was D5, so is Julia Maxwell right now. But the chances of having two or three of them in a very small school (much less 5) is minimal.

Doesn't change the fact that the point of the sport is competition at a team level as well as an individual level. What is the good of a competion scoring the best 5 out of 7 runners from one school vs. the best 5 out of 200 runners from one school? How is that comepetion? Should Alabama be playing football against Cal Tech?

As an aside, people are reacting to you the way they are in large part because you are being rude and hostile. I could see suggesting some sort of other way to ensure that the best race the best at the end (an individual meet of champions perhaps) but killing the chance for the hundreds of small schools to compete on a realistic team level seems heavyhanded and punitive.

Anonymous said...

No one is making excuses, and the truth does not hurt "youre" feelings. Sure, Jordan Hassay was D5, so is Julia Maxwell right now. But the chances of having two or three of them in a very small school (much less 5) is minimal.

Doesn't change the fact that the point of the sport is competition at a team level as well as an individual level. What is the good of a competion scoring the best 5 out of 7 runners from one school vs. the best 5 out of 200 runners from one school? How is that competion? Should Alabama be playing football against Cal Tech?

As an aside, people are reacting to you the way they are in large part because you are being rude and hostile. I could see suggesting some sort of other way to ensure that the best race the best at the end (an individual meet of champions perhaps) but killing the chance for the hundreds of small schools to compete on a realistic team level against similar teams seems heavyhanded and punitive.

Anonymous said...

How is this rude? Never has one insult been said or is this personal.

If anything "youre" sarcastic did was ther personal attack here. Cross country is an individual sport. If you want it to be a team sport contact the CIF and eliminate all rules that apply to individuals.

I'm sorry if you go to a small school with 400 people. But that is your choice. Right now D5 is a waist and would be better served at a larger population maximum. That's all I'm saying here. D2 & D3 suffers while the small privates clean up.

Ps. It more than one person agreeing on this so I'm not sure who you were responding to.

Anonymous said...

Nice spelling and grammar...

Why do so many people even care about the varying divisions? If you are a big-shot D1 runner, why do you care if some D5 runners get recognition for running the same time as you? Just because you're in a bigger division and place lower, others enjoying recognition in D4-5 shouldn't detract from your experience! Don't be so selfish.

Albert Caruana said...

I leave for a week and and come back to this.

I am actually one of those Division V coaches at a school with 260 students. I think 5 divisions are very fair and there has even been talk of having 6 divisions. You eliminate Division V and all of a sudden we could potentially be competing against schools 4-5 times our size. How many other schools have to do that currently?

As for cross country being an individual sport. Really? I usually have to explain this to people that know nothing about our sport not someone who visits my site.

Anonymous said...

@5:43:

Get a spellcheck!!!

If DV is a waist, then people who have spelling/grammar as bad as yours are a size 42.

OH!! Burned!!!

Anonymous said...

Hahahahaha. Ironic coming a kid who probably has never taken a spelling test and can't communicate without a computer.

Anonymous said...

Albert, maybe this thread is done?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous @7:36:

Apparently it's hard for you to communicate with a computer.

Anonymous said...

A ninja's work is never done!

Nils- not a statistician! said...

Wait, before you close the thread, could anyone give me *technical advice* on some number crunching? I've gotten very curious on how to compare the statistics of the performance of 50,000+ Div One with a 14,000+ Div Five (total school enrollment; Div V has 28% of Div I's total enrollment ). How would you statistics experts recommend comparing the Div I vs Div V 2012 all-school XC results? I have the data, I just need some rigorous protocol that generates some meaningful comparisons of the strength of the *average* runner of each division. Any ideas? (e.g. do I divide division I's finishers into blocks of 10 in successive order of finishing time, select a random 28% of each Div I cohort, compare with the results for Div V's cohorts of 3 (approx 28% of 10), and repeat a few times to calculate variance?)

Thanks!

Anonymous said...

The discrepancy in enrollment is the problem here. It should be an equal breakdown to be fair.

And on another note why close a thread that gives him tons of page views? No personal attracts here, just let the kids play.

Anonymous said...

Wow this is something... really guys? Just let DV do their thing and we will do ours. What matter is beating southern section at the end of the season. We are all NCS (or CCC).

Anonymous said...

How come D5 is a "waste"? What negative effects do smaller divisions have on larger divisions?

Someone pointed out that apparently D2 and D3 schools "suffer". How exactly do they suffer? And if they suffer, how is it connected to D5 schools?

For someone making such passionate points, you have yet to do anything besides make sweeping generalizations with no supporting arguments.

I'm not saying you're wrong. I just want to know your rational, because to be honest you're kind of sounding like a current or former runner from a larger school that's bitter you didn't get to run against smaller schools with weaker teams.

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