http://www.dyestatcal.com/ATHLETICS/XC/2011/ccsres.htm
Combined team results: http://www.dyestatcal.com/ATHLETICS/XC/2011/ccs_comb.htm
Pictures: http://www.dyestatcal.com/ATHLETICS/XC/2011/PICS/CCS/ccs.htm
Pictures of all the team winners coming up. Most impressive performances today?
Combined team results: http://www.dyestatcal.com/ATHLETICS/XC/2011/ccs_comb.htm
Pictures: http://www.dyestatcal.com/ATHLETICS/XC/2011/PICS/CCS/ccs.htm
Pictures of all the team winners coming up. Most impressive performances today?
I didn't actually see it, but most impressive has to go to Aptos girls, running somewhere around #6 all time on that course.
ReplyDeleteGood call Evan. I don't think anybody predicted before the meet that Aptos would have the fastest team time for girls. Now it does help to lead off but with a 17:05 but still...
ReplyDeletecongrats to Nikki! it was an amazing race to watch, and she did it all on her own too.. she was so close to the all time record!! at least she still has next year
ReplyDeletegood luck to her and her team at states
Hopefully this will finally silence all the people who complained about the Carlmont coaching change and complained that Coach Jennifer Randazzo was doing things wrong. Very soon after this whole debacle she has rebuilt the whole team and they did the unthinkable - sweep the competitive D1 races (beating teams like Bellarmine for the boys and Gunn for the girls is incredible). I admit I was a doubter as well but Coach Randazzo has me convinced, way to go!
ReplyDeleteKind of Interesting about aptos, how did Stranger run CCS when she didn't participate in very many XC meets and League championships when all results showed her playing water polo instead? be curious to see if she ran 50% the meets? Someone needs to find out!
ReplyDeleteAptos will face a character test...
ReplyDeleteCongrats Albert on your team sweeping D5!
ReplyDeleteHiltz's time is amazing!! But Sarah Robinson ran really well, too. I didn't think she was THAT fast. Congrats to all who ran, and also to those who advance to state.
Aptos was absolutely amazing today and they by far had one of the most outstanding races of the year.
ReplyDeleteAs for the "character test" comment I think that is rude and uncalled for. They put together an outstanding squad of their best runners from their school which we all strive to do. I am assuming that the athlete was cleared by their league commissioner and we should not take away from anything they have accomplished. My stance regarding this rule has always been that it should apply to individuals, not a team. A coach should be able to field their best team just as any football or baseball team is allowed to. These are kids, and they should be allowed to run. Politics aside, they would have won the D3 Championship with their 6th runner finishing as their #5.
It is not rude or uncalled for. These are kids. True. And what are we teaching. You said it - you are assuming! Let's hear from the League Commissioner. Nobody wants to take away from the Team or Nicki's great performance but the process should be honored and the coach accountible if there was a foul. What message are you sending to the kids.
ReplyDeleteThe CCS rule does apply to individuals and not teams:
ReplyDelete"In individual sports, (swimming, track & field, cross country, tennis, golf, gymnastics, badminton, wrestling), a student athlete must compete in at least ½ of the regularly-scheduled league meets in order to participate in the CCS playoffs in that sport."
http://www.cifccs.org/cbp/policies/playoff%20policy.pdf
hank
Skeptic,
ReplyDeleteYou are wrong. If an ineligible runner was used the team should be disqualified. It is no different if a team used an academically ineligible runner. The rules are there for a reason. The 50% rule is in place so that teams do not bring in a top athlete for CCS that has not been a part of the team all year.
If this is the case it should be reported to the CCS and the team should be disqualified.
Lets be honest, no one will report Aptos and even if they did CCS wouldn't change anything so this is a moot point. While this may be front page news if a football team played an ineligible player it is way too much drama for a low level sport and they won't want to touch it with a 10 foot pole.
ReplyDeleteAnd can anyone even confirm that Aptos' runner did not compete in 50% of the league meets? If they did run with an ineligible runner they should be DQ'd, as the rule "hank" posted is very clear.
One question is, what happens to the results? Is Aptos DQ'd as a team and get to go as individuals?
This can have an effect on many things here, if Aptos is DQ'd, Saratoga (who had one hell of a race by the way) gets to go. But then won't Aptos take most of the individual spots knocking out kids who thought they made it to State? This is a mess...
But as I said, CCS will not want to touch this controversy and will let it play out as is. This is what they are paid to do but I know I wouldn't want to come near this and let it just go away!
Then address the runner individually, the team moves on. Address the Coach and the school. Or stop marketing the honor code, character, integrity and ethics a standard of sportsmanship. Let the kids know how it really is in the world. Maybe your doing them a favor.
ReplyDeleteI agree this needs to be addressed but also agree it won't be... Did they run with an ineligible runner? No one has said yet. If they have it should be a DQ for the team. If they were all eligible then there is no argument here.
ReplyDeleteInstead of acusations lets see some proof, otherwise this thread should die.
FYI: Aptos did the proper thing and Got permission from SCCAL and CCS approval to run Aptos runner! so time to move on so we can all go and represent the CCS with some great showing to come! SCCAL League Rep: Rob Collins
ReplyDeleteThanks Rob.
ReplyDeleteBest of luck to all the CCS competitors at the state meet.
Thanks Rob. Cross Country "teams" should be under the team rule, individuals that qualify under the individual rule.
ReplyDeleteOur sport teams qualify as well as individuals. Swimming and track only individuals, there is no "team" advancement. Perhaps the rule should be addressed at the end of the season to reflect the dual nature of our sport.
This rule was covered at the post season CCS meeting last year. Steve Filios from the CCS office can explain it a lot better than me if you want a clarification.
ReplyDeleteRob, what was the reasoning behind allowing an athlete who did not run 50% of the races in CCS. Was it medical, academic? Those seem like the only reasons allowed by the rule unless they plan to change it.
ReplyDeleteHiltz and Robinson's (as well as Estrada, Maxwell) performances need to be put into perspective. Just a few years ago, we were all very impressed with Jennifer Bergman's 17:16 (fastest time in a while at Crystal Springs) and Bergman has been having one of the most successful college careers of any CCS runner. These times are absolutely incredible for the girls... we are looking at an era similar to the 80s right here.
ReplyDeleteWow - So they were allowed to break the rule, when everyone else went out of their way to follow it? Something doesn't seem right to me about that. If the rule doesn't need to be followed by all, then get rid of it.
ReplyDeleteThey did not break the rule. SCCAL has 4 League meets, Stanger ran it two of them thus fulfilling the 50% rule required by CCS. As Coach Collins said above, this was all cleared with the SCCAL Commissioner and CCS office prior to the CCS meet so let's put it to rest.
ReplyDeletehank
"Jennifer Bergman's 17:16 (fastest time in a while at Crystal Springs)"
ReplyDeleteOh, how quickly we forget.
The girls' times are definitely impressive, and all those girls mentioned will likely have very successful college careers. However, it is dangerous to compare them with Bergman, as she had continual bad luck (sickness, injury) throughout high school that really hindered her ability to train. Now that she is relatively injury free, she is really seeing her potential. If she had been injury/illness free in high school, she might have been in the 16's at Crystal.
ReplyDeleteHank,
ReplyDeleteTechnically they have 5, including the SCCAL meet.
If she met the 50% rule then why did the athlete need to be cleared by CCS? Something doesn't add up and it would be nice to know what.
If you look at the SCCAL XC By-Laws:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.sccal.org/constitution3.htm#CROSS
It doesn't state if the League Championship meet is to be considered a "Regularly scheduled league meet" as the CCS rule states (you would need to contact CCS for clarification on this), so, as the CCS rule states, it could be interpreted that the Championships aren't considered a league meet (I understand that Championships are considered post-competition, qualifying for CCS, and are not included in a leagues maximum # of contests so one might also interpret that the League Championship is not counted as a League meet). Once again, one would need to contact CCS and/or the SCCAL Commissioner to get further clarification on what is/isn't considered a League meet. So if the Championship Meet is not counted, then the 50% rule was fulfilled.
As to why they needed to clear this with CCS and the SCCAL Commissioner first, well, it could be a whole host of things (maybe concern about playing 2 sports during the same season, etc) but you would need to contact the Aptos AD in order to get their reasons for why they did what they did.
hank
Either way, props to the coach and the kids for running so well... down in the south end of the section we knew the potential Aptos had all season and it was good to see them put it together... state should be fun for them!!! Carlmont sure did a great job also coming together at the end! Here's hoping all CCS teams and runners represent the section well at state! We have some GREAT crews and individuals representing!!!
ReplyDeleteCoach Ibarra
NMC
Aptos did not break any rules. Jackie Stanger ran in 2 out of the 4 league meets. If you can calculate it thats 50%. Aptos still would have won their division if you take out Jackie (there number 5) and count their number 6 Karen Himenez as their 5th. Thats how good they are! Congrats to Aptos and all of the other teams and individuals that qualified for state!
ReplyDeleteum leave her alone she followed the rulz
ReplyDeleteTo Anonymous 8:27pm....please note that all of the Carlmont Varsity boys and their #1 girl train with RF United off season. Randazzo just accepts the credit.
ReplyDeleteI thought we had moved on from this unnecessary sniping. Sadly. I am wrong.
ReplyDeleteMaybe "Carlmont Parent" should just go by "RF United Parent"--it would seem more fitting.
ReplyDeleteSorry but I am just stating some facts that Anonymous 8:27pm obviously does not know.
ReplyDeleteCarlmont Parent - Let me get this straight. First someone give props to the Carlmont coach after the boys and girls sweep CCS. Next you feel the need to point out the team trained the whole summer with their old coach while also taking a dig at Carlmont coach.
ReplyDeleteI don't follow CCS so I'm a bit confused. Who coached the Carlmont kids from mid-August to now?
First lets make this straight. League is not post-season, all teams compete in the "LEAGUE" finals so it is a league meet. 2 of 5 is not 50%. And what two races did this girl compete in? We still have not heard why there would be a reason to go to the CCS for a waiver then. It doesn't add up. Why then did the SCCAL not let her run their league meet if she met the 50%?
ReplyDeleteAnd as for Carlmont, who cares who did what in the summer. Do you really think that if a kid comes home for the summer and then wins an NCAA Championship that who they trained with in the summer gets the credit? It is mileage. It is awesome that there is a coach willing to do this over the summer (for money) so they can have organized structure, but it is the coach during the season that gets the credit.
Need another analogy? I have never heard a strength and conditioning coach who works with the team in the off season try to take credit for winning the super bowl. Part of the reason, sure they get a ring, but the main reason, nope.
Here is the reality of it all. Aptos probably broke the rules and is stretching the rules like "its 4, not 5." This should be clarified then if the final meet is NOT a league meet in the rules. But who gives a crap, the kid goes to their school so if you can't beat them with a water polo player then shame on you.
And shame on you for trying to steal credit from a head coach who came into a crappy situation did their best and is having success. Who care who ran what in the off season. Most good kids do run in the summer with or without a coach so get over it.
I deleted previous post because of the profanity but here it is without the enthusiastic language:
ReplyDeleteim good friends with jackie, i run for the aptos cross country team myself. there's no conspiracy theory or anything like that. jackie was very busy with water polo and could only make practice 1 day a week as it is, only because she was a star polo player. so that alone should give her some respect. the way our schedule lined up was that we had 4 meets that were competing for league, 2 of which were at aptos and she could skip water polo practice those days to attend. she needed to be cleared because she didnt compete at SCCAL, our league meet because she had the SCCAL water polo game at the same time. calm down now.