tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post2641013899001053332..comments2024-03-27T17:43:26.504-07:00Comments on Cross Country Express: WCAL Meet Preview courtesy of John RankrAlbert Caruanahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14434646351717864405noreply@blogger.comBlogger90125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-78899840980915999992015-11-13T09:09:06.577-08:002015-11-13T09:09:06.577-08:00Marcos - thanks for your great perspective. I sens...Marcos - thanks for your great perspective. I sense that the general feeling is that private schools do have an unfair advantage because they can pull from a much wider area than the public schools. And yes, coaching can make a big difference and attract athletes to the school. That being said, there are plenty of great public HSXC coaches. It would be interesting to see what Victor Santamaria at Willow Glen could do with 150+ boys coming out for his cross country team.Binghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14649571959714313060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-75099073785317141022015-11-12T11:40:24.145-08:002015-11-12T11:40:24.145-08:00As a former Bellarmine XC runner I am glad to see ...As a former Bellarmine XC runner I am glad to see that the program I graduated from is now on the minds of many. I usually never post anything and mostly read the articles posted and sometimes venture on the comments, but I felt a need to post as to what some have posted suggests a sense of recruiting. Honestly I could care less about recruiting. If a kid can get a good education and better themselves in athletics hats off to them, but what the suggestion of recruiting does is diminish what Coach Patrick McCrystle has done with the program. He's turned Bellarmine into a consistent program which is something very hard to do considering most of the kids in that program have never run a day in their life. Yet, it's through a great coaching staff that the program succeeds. I've seen and been a part of what the program was and what it is now with the large turnout each year. I can say honestly while I was running we took great joy in our numbers and being the team to beat in our league and in some cases our section, but we learned a sense of respect for those we ran against and each time we went to state we went to go represent not only our school, but our section that was never looked at the same way the south was. <br /><br />To say that a private school has an unfair advantage to a public school in the sport of cross country I think is a little unusual. I don't know what advantages I gained from running at Bellarmine in my athletic career other than phenomenal coaching. Compared to the public schools we ran the same trails, had the same type of equipment, and probably the same support we received from our school. I lost to a lot of public school teams. Some great ones. Never once did I believe we lost or should've won because of what school I went to. Rather we felt we just lost to some great runners. The only advantage/disadvantage that does occur I think is the disadvantage that all XC teams in WCAL receive due to some football rules that prevents incoming Freshman from practicing with the team during the summer. That leaves all WCAL teams with very little time to get their Freshman up to speed before their first race.<br /><br />The strength of the program comes from the coach's ability to find runners out of the woodworks to come to practice day in and out and give it everything they have that given day to improve their skill. I was one of those runners who never ran a lick, but through the coaching staff was able to progress and be successful enough to continue to run after high school. So when I feel someone suggests of unfair advantages athletically within private school program just remember you diminish the hard work and dedication that many of these not only coaches but teachers put in with their respective teams, and honestly who would cheat on high school cross country. Marcos Hinojosanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-22159479153600533322015-11-06T23:15:10.670-08:002015-11-06T23:15:10.670-08:00This thread is great! Love all the people hiding ...This thread is great! Love all the people hiding behind "Anonymous"; one of the most mature comments is from @10:34 am - a student. <br /><br />Private schools with great programs are able to get the attention of the kids and this allows them to sometimes have kids attend their schools who might not otherwise. If that introduction/awareness comes from their JO Coach, club coach, family friend, XC Express, or wherever, it doesn't matter. These schools had to build their great programs, that is not an easy task. Traditionally, great programs are built by great coaches (Sorry @10:29). The schools don't need to recruit but they do have an evangelical like following, why wouldn't they when they have such a great program. <br /><br />XC programs are best when you can get as many runners as possible to come out for the team. Coaches make the sport popular on campus and a fun atmosphere for the students. More runners participating allows for more pack runs, more competitive practices, and a stronger team The results do not come from a coach giving the same workout to all the kids who come out to practice that day. It takes a great deal of time, knowledge, coaching and attention.<br /><br />Schools with this level of coaching do well. McCrystle (Bell), Sanataria (Willow Glen), Sealy (Homestead), Wilmurt & Hale (Menlo Atherton, White & Lawson (Lynbrook), and arguably the G.O.A.T Peanut Hamrs (El Dorado Hills-SJS) are all great coaches. They deserve their praise for building amazing programs. They do a lot to help students turn into adults. Their impact is felt far beyond the XC course or track. They often do it by themselves without the help of assistants (>70 kids:1 coach - what a ratio!). <br /><br />Kids are going to go to school where their parents decide, end of story. My son runs at a public school, we love the program and would not want to trade it for anything. We have family friends with a runner on Bellarmine, they love that program (BTW, kid never ran a race in his life before HS and is now on Varsity-100% not recruited).<br /><br />Next time you see a "successful" program, check out the attitude of the JV team. If they are having a blast while running 30-40 miles/week then that is a good coach and a positive environment, tip your hat to them instead of being so negative. It doesn't cost you a thing to give credit, heck, with all that positive thinking you just might end up remembering your name and being able to post it above your comment. <br /><br />PS - Hank, thanks for the clarification on Robison's time. Glad he will be logged as a sub 15 guy; amazing race.Ron Ernsthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04307910146172526879noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-59426230049903748222015-11-06T14:33:39.297-08:002015-11-06T14:33:39.297-08:00Albert,
How about an interview of the Greenfield ...Albert,<br /><br />How about an interview of the Greenfield coach(es)?<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-33319726936231161322015-11-06T12:31:27.814-08:002015-11-06T12:31:27.814-08:00What about Greenfield? The town is so small they b...What about Greenfield? The town is so small they barely get a sign on 101.<br />Small School 964 students.<br />Likely under privileged or ESL. 3/10 Great Schools score. 632 API. Only 20% go to 4yr. <br /><br />However they managed these rankings in CCS according to Hanks handy website referenced below. <br />#12 for boys, Between Gunn and Saratoga.<br />#14 for girls. Between Mt View and Presentation.<br />King City is #18 for boys.<br /><br />Palo Alto, Saratoga, Mt View, Willow Glen are some most priviledged areas in the south bay and they are getting worked over by migrant worker schools. From the running perspective they are doing something right. Someone should make a movie about that.<br /><br />http://lynbrooksports.prepcaltrack.com/ATHLETICS/XC/2015/ccs_pred.htm<br />http://www.greatschools.org/california/greenfield/3253-Greenfield-High-School/<br /><br />So most of us are tired of this. Quit whining or go somewhere else. <br />Become a better coach, GET A BETTER ATTITUDE, coach at a different school. Better yet, give the stopwatch to someone else. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-26126351326983396572015-11-06T11:49:35.999-08:002015-11-06T11:49:35.999-08:00please post your athletic.net profile in your comm...please post your athletic.net profile in your comment before you criticize anyoneAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-61870644699018922552015-11-06T11:09:59.133-08:002015-11-06T11:09:59.133-08:00I disagree on distance running being a wealthy spo...I disagree on distance running being a wealthy sport. McFarland proved that.<br />Skiing, golf, Swimming, and Polo are wealthy sports. Whereas football, hockey, and baseball require some investment in gear.<br /><br />Distance running is about as cheap as basketball and soccer. And very very few get wealthy distance running.<br /><br />However it takes a long time to get really good. Months of preparation for a small window of peak performance. The only people watching are your relatives and teammates.<br /><br />Schools need to have a culture around running. Build some excitement to attract a large enough pool of kids from which to find the stars.<br /><br />The Santa Cruz schools are small but they manage to get good talent. <br />Aptos 1382<br />Santa Cruz 1147<br />San Lorenzo Val 719<br /><br />Bellarmine should definitely do better based on their size and the work the coaches and athletes put in month after month. My best argument for them CONSISTENCY. They win League the divisions year after year. Let me pause there and say that's huge. Some of the underclassmen may never make varsity, but being part of a team that wins the freshman, or sophomore, or JV division really means something to these guys.<br /><br />Continuing... Bell wins or places well at CCS year after year. Few very schools can make that claim. <br /><br />Lastly they take a team to the state meet on a regular basis. <br /><br />Most importantly the kids stay with the program.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-44492524952130803922015-11-06T11:01:31.821-08:002015-11-06T11:01:31.821-08:00I wouldn't be so sure these comments are comin...I wouldn't be so sure these comments are coming from parents. Remember there's a ton of us Marxist out here who aren't So "Rah Rah" About getting our teeth kicked in by teams that get to benefit from an unfair advantage. There are plenty of good coaches that feel this way. You say I'm jealous, and I say the system is rigged to favor a few. This message board is a nice way for people to vent. Albert usually plays peacemaker. I totally understand. This is not what his site is about. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-33862614644037187252015-11-06T10:51:35.805-08:002015-11-06T10:51:35.805-08:00@10:34 Agreed. The public vs private dispute has ...@10:34 Agreed. The public vs private dispute has been settled and it is over! Both have great attributes and provide the kids with excellent opportunities to succeed. Let's not speak of it again. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-54647862476742992952015-11-06T10:50:10.234-08:002015-11-06T10:50:10.234-08:00Well said, 10:34. Thanks for being the voice of sa...Well said, 10:34. Thanks for being the voice of sanity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-9841251378236959462015-11-06T10:34:04.009-08:002015-11-06T10:34:04.009-08:00As a varsity runner from a WCAL team, I thought I ...As a varsity runner from a WCAL team, I thought I might add an opinion from an actual athlete on this thread. The sport of cross country is about high school kids training as hard as they can to compete to their best of their ability in races, all while having fun in the process. The sport of cross country is also about having great coaches to guide runners to become the best they can be. And that is all it is about, the athletes and their coaches, not the parents commenting on this thread. As an athlete I can tell these comments are not originating from athletes because these subjects do not matter to them, they put aside all the politics and just compete. It is unfortunate that all these athletes, teams, and coaches are having these negative comments being directed towards them when they are just trying to enjoy a great high school running experience. Please do not continue to turn this great website into a collection of negative comments and remember the sport is about the athletes not the parents. Thank you. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-927293961519294692015-11-06T09:32:18.521-08:002015-11-06T09:32:18.521-08:00The private schools kids work just as hard, and ha...The private schools kids work just as hard, and have just as much heart as the public school kids. I just believe that talent pool is the biggest reason for success. Stop pumping up these programs that don't ever produce top individuals, and only dominate because they benefit from an unfair advantage that most other teams can't benefit from. Bellarmine had better have a great team time. Are you kidding me? They have a BVAL/SCVAL All Star team. Give me 50 kids with a personal best of 4:50 or better for 1600 and I'll set that CCS team record. The real feat is constructing this network with the clubs and Jr. High coaches so all the talented kids get funneled into certain programs. All the while claiming nobody ever talks or recruits anyone. B.S. Everyone knows the playbook on how to skirt the rules. Just move B4 high school, or get that new family friend's address once your parents separate. Let's not act like the Peidmont Hills situation is an anomaly. SCCAL is the new hotbed for kids just appearing at schools magically. Kids aren't supposed to be moving for athletic reasons or because they might not get the right training for that scholarship. This is not what H.S. sports is about. Skirting the rules has become a way for the privileged to act like they're kids interest is more important than the next, and the clubs and private coaches are there to say "yes they are". Here's how you do it. Now pay me. If everyone was so concerned for the sport, there'd be more of a "grass routes movement" to install better coaches at the public school level. Not just move the kids who they feel deserve the proper training, or to find a program that allows them to train exclusively with their club, or on their own. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-21818432776619481682015-11-06T09:26:24.748-08:002015-11-06T09:26:24.748-08:00I would argue that Bellarmine has done quite well ...I would argue that Bellarmine has done quite well at the state meet and most times have exceeded the pre-meet prognostications. Division I in CA is incredibly competitive and for them to finish in the top 10 consistently is a great achievement. Lastly, to win in Division I, you need a couple of runners that can break into the top 10-20 at the state meet which as an example was 15:27 last year for top 10 (about 15:07 at CS) and 15:40 for top 20 (about 15:20 at CS). Albert Caruanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14434646351717864405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-82949981253659889972015-11-06T09:18:35.764-08:002015-11-06T09:18:35.764-08:00This topic is certainly emotional, regardless of w...This topic is certainly emotional, regardless of which side you're on! <br /><br />For me - when I hear folks on here wanting to "celebrate" Bellarmine's amazing team time at Crystal, I find myself feeling much less impressed knowing that they're pulling from an amazingly large talent pool. Whether that's a fair thought or not, it's my logical reaction. If you have 150 boys in your program, statistics say you will have ~15 elite level runners. So OF COURSE they are going to have an amazing team. For that reason, I am shocked that BCP has never won a state title. I'm not quite sure why -- but it's amazing that they haven't excelled at the state level. <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-6154510353955529142015-11-06T09:10:12.594-08:002015-11-06T09:10:12.594-08:008:50am Sarcastic much?8:50am Sarcastic much?Albert Caruanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14434646351717864405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-7314559804258316292015-11-06T08:54:00.270-08:002015-11-06T08:54:00.270-08:00Yes, sticky topic so we can limit the P vs. P disc...Yes, sticky topic so we can limit the P vs. P discussion there. We can all rip each other and get nowhere but at least we can get it out in a safe space. That way, only those looking for a fight will enter and the rest of the site can be about the great sport of XC. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-90404823765867851342015-11-06T08:50:15.063-08:002015-11-06T08:50:15.063-08:00Running (specifically distance running) is general...Running (specifically distance running) is generally a wealthy sport. Success in high school sports, in general, requires a lot of wealth. Based soley on this, someone at a private high school (requires wealth to be there) is statistically more likely to be a distance runner. Therefore, a private school's cross country team is statistically more likely to be successful. And when you take into account a sample size as large as the CIF, you will often find that the statistics prevail.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-19517952383106673692015-11-06T08:48:27.685-08:002015-11-06T08:48:27.685-08:00This topic will only be allowed on this post. I wi...This topic will only be allowed on this post. I will delete any future comments on this subject attached to other posts.<br /><br />Agreed with the last comment in that "winning" programs attract future students/families with their continued success year in, year out.Albert Caruanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14434646351717864405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-33609935183700402082015-11-06T08:45:42.936-08:002015-11-06T08:45:42.936-08:00To Sal@8:21: Exactly...Bellarmine runs 77:46 as a ...To Sal@8:21: Exactly...Bellarmine runs 77:46 as a team, and not one person mentions that! All they want to do is vent and perpetuate rumors...their team ran 77:46! That's good...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-28687666648501602042015-11-06T08:43:43.186-08:002015-11-06T08:43:43.186-08:00In all honesty, I think what's really being ig...In all honesty, I think what's really being ignored here is the fact that excellence recruits itself. If I'm in a (socioeconomic, geographic) position to choose what school my child will attend, I'm going to give them the best possible opportunities I can. So yes, if my child is a promising cross country runner, I'm going to look at cross country programs. If school A regularly makes state meet appearances, goes to the big track meets and regularly turns 8th graders of my child's caliber into college-ready, athletes that may put it over the top of otherwise-equal school B. Is this unfair to developing programs? Maybe. Is it illegal? Certainly not.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-79125082555074331632015-11-06T08:43:17.332-08:002015-11-06T08:43:17.332-08:00Albert,
Can you please create a sticky topic for ...Albert,<br /><br />Can you please create a sticky topic for just this subject. They can debate it there without infecting every other topic.<br /><br />You have a great site, and you're doing a great service for the NorCal running community. Personally I'm really tired of the vitriol week after week. I'm ready to take my eyeballs elsewhere.<br /><br />Public & Private School Parent.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-84175151730802670302015-11-06T08:21:29.456-08:002015-11-06T08:21:29.456-08:00I bet that none of the comments about public vs. p...I bet that none of the comments about public vs. private is from the athletes. They come from jealous people that can't stand the fact that kids have a choice. This thread has been building for some time and it is good that we are having it out in a raw and often crazy way. Nobody gets recruited or gets a scholarship to run in HS. Period. If you have evidence about a specific program or athlete, either call them out here or go to the CIF. If not, please spare us all the histrionics so we can talk about the great performances from the last week and the ones to come. Salnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-31407630109150011902015-11-06T07:45:42.172-08:002015-11-06T07:45:42.172-08:00I am a D1 public school varsity runner in NCS... a...I am a D1 public school varsity runner in NCS... and all I can say is I'm happy I'm not in CCS. I've never heard an athlete I've raced speak the way the people on this blog have.<br />On the public vs. private debate, Fiona O'Keefe, Cate Ratliff, and Brooke Starn all go to public schools, and they have most of the fastest times in the state. You cannot leave out cold-hard facts from your debate simply because they do not help you.<br />From an athlete's prospective, I am deeply disappointed in what I read on this forum sometimes. We run because it's fun, there's friendly competition, and keeps us healthy. Yes, it's also about being the best runner you can be, but it's also about being the best person you can be. I don't see that here. Maybe that's because these are not the actual athletes writing such horrible things - with the anonymous option, we will never know.<br />Perhaps because I'm a girl and from NCS my comment does not apply to the argument, but I felt an athlete's voice needed to be heard. Also, if anyone wants to discount my comment because I go to a public school, in just a few days I will be signing with a D1 college with a full-ride to run. That school is also public. Please do not discount someone's program simply because the school does not ask for a tuition. I know mine has helped me to reach my goals.DWnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-87508058176535811572015-11-06T07:10:43.757-08:002015-11-06T07:10:43.757-08:00Most of the top teams in the state, especially in ...Most of the top teams in the state, especially in the upper divisions, are public schools. Great Oak, Dana Hills, Saugus, Arcadia, Brea Olinda, Palos Verdes etc. Big enrollments plus good coaching = very fast teams.Albert Caruanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14434646351717864405noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31292861.post-1938727878346983472015-11-06T06:01:02.397-08:002015-11-06T06:01:02.397-08:00Okay, let's get out all the crazy. I thought w...Okay, let's get out all the crazy. I thought we were arguing that all the good kids go to the private schools and that's not fair, but apparently we are now arguing that none of the kids in the WCAL are good enough. Both points are not correct and that is why this argument will never be settled. Kids go to school where their parents live or where they can afford to go. Maybe XC has something to do with their choice but isn't that a good thing? Choice is good. And the choice of the good kids to go to a private school should force the public schools to hire better coaches (and they have as is listed in one of the posts above). This is the ebb and flow of life. Choice (an open market) and the ability to choose not to go to the public school (which otherwise has a monopoly) makes all of the programs better. So, let's agree to disagree on a kid's ability to choose where they go to school, but let's agree that this area has great runners and great coaches and the programs have been made better by the competition. I would also ask Albert to keep this blog near the top so that we can have a place to argue about the public vs private thing and not have it infect every comment section, no matter what the original post. It gets tiresome. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com